Has Church Doctrine Become Culturally Conditioned? (PART TWO)

PAUL’S STATEMENT STANDS!  (1 Corinthians 14) –

women-preaching

In fact, in many translations, including the Greek rendition available in the Parallel New Testament, part b of verse 33 is connected to verse 34, making the statement even stronger:

[33 b.] As [is the practice] in all the churches of the saints (God’s people),  [34] the women should keep quiet in the churches, for they are not authorized to speak, but should take a secondary and subordinate place, just as the Law also says.  [Gen. 3:16].

“Women” is translated “wives” by some modern translations, though the same word is rendered “women” in other passages.

1 Timothy 5:2 commands  younger “women” (same word) to marry.  Try “wives” there!

But even if it were “wives”, the command is generally disobeyed.

And why the word “your” in verse one?

“Do not rebuke an older man harshly. but exhort him as if he were your father…”

The letter is addressed to the church.  So then, the “your” refers to that church, not to the men of that church only!

Women in Church Should Be “QUIET”.

They are not permitted to speak and permission is denied because… God’s original standard was set down in Genesis, not because of some local restraint placed on them by woman-hater Paul.

In Paul’s mind, the opposite of female authority is female submission; not submission to male dominance but submission (subject to) God’s authority in the relationship (Ephesians 5:21, 27).

1 Corinthians 14:35 mentions a possible incident that may have given rise to Paul’s instruction, but this doesn’t in any way affect the strong language in verse 34.

I think that it is possible, women were shaming their husbands by raising their voice in the assembly; boldly questioning the speakers and ignoring the fact that their own husbands could supply them the knowledge needed.  At least this is the gist of the “myth” that has been created to make this verse understandable to us. Although, I’m not aware of any historical proof-text from which this story is raised.

Paul tells them that such action is not called for, that women are to be SILENT.

He settles the Corinthian issue, but in so doing, it should settle our issue too, if we will hear him.

SILENCE means no more questions!  It follows that this also means…no more TEACHING!

If the simple asking of a question is met with such shock from the man of God, with what spiritual rage would a full-blown lesson be met?

KEEP SILENT.  It’s shameful!  Is this not clear?

Much of the New Testament was written to correct a local issue.  But for the most part, we don’t shrug off the teachings because they were first written to the “early” Christians.  We should assume the eternality of the Word from God.  Why not here?

Paul goes on to ask, (1 Corinthians 14, verse 36, paraphrased)..

‘Are you the originators of Scripture?  Are you in charge here?  Is it to be your feelings and experiences that will determine the practices and doctrine of the church of God?’

More than that!  (verse 37)…‘even if there be among you a “godly” person who basks in his great revelations from Heaven, let him come down out of the clouds long enough to realize that we’re dealing with the Prophet Moses and the Apostle Paul.’

(Verse 38),  ‘Of course, if you’d rather be ignorant, go ahead, but to your own peril.’

But doesn’t Paul contradict himself here?

1 Corinthians 11:5, Paul earlier pointed out the phenomenon of the praying and prophesying woman.

“See, women DID speak out in the assembly!”

It’s good for us that Paul himself wrote both of the passages chapters apart, or men would be pitting Paul against other church leaders.  As it is, we need only to harmonize the thoughts of one man, convinced he didn’t contradict himself.

In the first place, it’s hard to prove that the woman mentioned here is praying or prophesying in a public assembly.  The context is again the man and woman relationship (verse 3), and could be easily seen as the area of the home.

Just a note in passing here, that people coming to this passage may be looking for relief for the poor restricted women, and only find more restriction (vss. 5-6); her liberty in the form of the head covering, another taboo topic to Western preaching.

In Paul’s letter to his traveling companion and young minister in training, Timothy, Paul gives instructions as to the setup of churches governmental structure.

Before stating the qualifications for a man who would be the church official servant, Paul specifically spells out the role of women, or “wives” if you prefer:

1 Timothy 2:9 (AMP):

tumblr_nm7dpzttor1s865f6o1_500

[9]  Also [I desire] that women should adorn themselves modestly and appropriately and sensibly in seemly apparel, not with [elaborate] hair arrangement or gold or pearls or expensive clothing.

Then being consistent with his word in Corinth and God’s Word to Adam and Eve, he demands silence and submission.

He goes a step further here with the step that’s implied to the Corinthian Church:

A WOMAN IS NEVER TO…

1.  teach a man, or…

2.  have authority over a man.

His reasons are not cultural, historical, or temporary.  It is not “wicked Corinth,” as some love to explain.  No, every age is wicked, including our own, as we almost certainly have entered the great apostasy.  

That said,  Paul had left Timothy in Ephesus (1:3), and it is here addressed.  And, his reasons are theological, Scriptural, and based in the origins of ALL things:

#1.  ADAM was formed first.

#2.  WOMAN sinned first, bringing the natural order under the Law.

I realize that these words are painful to the modern ear.  This is a “hard saying” to them.  But those who get their arms around hard sayings should allow it to make hardened soldiers of Christ, and not allow REBELLION to spoil the perfect work of God.

Would this APOSTLE approve of the present set-up of our churches?  Would he favor women on the ruling board of a congregation?  How about women teaching in our adult Bible class?  I think not!

“How about all these women the Bible talks about who were great “religious” leaders?

Probably the most prominent of Old Covenant women that comes to mind is DEBORAH.

If there’s a woman in the Bible that gives any support to “female leadership” advocates, it’s this incredible prophetess.  And yet, with close examination of what the Bible actually records, reveals that theimages entire extent of her work was the receiving of God’s WISDOM miraculously for the people who came to her as she “would sit under the palm tree.” This is how she “JUDGED” the nation through the WISDOM OF GOD, not the arm of fleshly power. Here is not an exalted elder.  Here was a simple handmaiden of the Lord who received His messages and passed them on.  She is never seen TEACHING in an assembly and taking AUTHORITY over men.  At the most, she claims for herself in the battles won, that she was “a mother in Israel”  (Judges 5:7).

There’s a PRINCIPLE established in DEBORAH, not broken:

In all visible ways, MEN must lead the people of God.  But this special woman of God teaches us that women will be used to receive revelation from God through PROPHECY, since gender is not a factor when the fullness of God is present.

This PRINCIPLE helps us understand more fully Paul’s seeming “contradiction” in 1 Corinthians 14.  

There, women are commanded to BE SILENT for all normal functions of the Church.  BUT, when God raises up a woman to speak (chapter 11), when He fulfils the prophecy of Joel to pour out His Spirit on His “handmaidens,” and the prophecy of the Word of the Lord, or pray empowered by that same Spirit, let not any take issue with them!

After Deborah judges, the kings rule Israel.  No women are seen RULING the kingdom except in gross disobedience (Jezebel).

IN THE LIFE OF JESUS…

In the life of Jesus Himself, it’s only with the most difficult “stretches” we see any women, even His mother, raised to “AUTHORITY” by His command.

  • Women give money to His ministry.
  • Women support their apostle husbands.
  • Women tell the story of Jesus to their neighbors.
  • Women praise Him and weep for Him and women see His resurrected Body and announce such…

BUT no woman rules or teaches any man in all the Gospels.

In the history of our Church, the Book of Acts, one must prove or lose their case dealing with church “issues.”

If you can’t DISCERN even a single female teacher or leader there, it becomes apparent that current female leadership is being driven, promoted by, another spirit.

We have run out of history!

The godly women of the Bible… ALL submitted to their husbands (Ephesians 5:24). And men, who are reading this…stop grinning at the words “submitted to” [Read Ephesians 5:25].  

The ungodly rebelled and were judged.  Women prophesied, but none ruled in Israel or the Church.  None were called upon to TEACH except by Paul, who asks older women to teach younger women (Titus 2:4).

Women are called to SILENCE in public assemblies except in the area of PROPHECY.

“Are there no other female voices to be raised?  

How about the woman Phoebe in the Bible?”  (Romans 16:1-2)

[1]  NOW I introduce and commend to you our sister Phoebe, a deaconess of the church at Cenchreae.  [2] That you may receive her in the Lord [with a Christian welcome], as saints (God’s people) ought to receive one another.  And help her in whatever matter she may require assistance from you, for she has been a helper of many including myself [shielding us from suffering]  (Amplified Bible).

A total of TWO VERSES describe all we know of her.  We learn that she served the church, she needs assistance in that service, she helped many people, and she helped the apostle Paul.

To raise this SERVANT of the Lord to church office and leadership is to once more, ask Paul to contradict Paul!  All we know is that she SERVED!

The Greek “diakonos,” a term here applied to Phoebe, is translated SERVANT, deacon, minister at various times in Paul’s writings.  Paul and Phoebe were both called “diakonos” – SERVANT.  Paul wasn’t an “official” DEACON, nor was Phoebe.

Oh, how we all love to make a big deal out of titles!

Distinct from this general servant-hood, is the call for men to be “official” servants, deacons, chosen by the church as were the original 7 of Acts 6.

For these men, SERVICE was not given as they desired, but as the ELDERS needed. Yes, “deacons” could preach and minister in the miraculous, but their calling was to be “on call.”

There are MANY WOMEN who serve and served Jesus in the Bible, but none in AUTHORITY–NONE!

Paul didn’t allow it.

But wait, the apostle John has a word for us.  Actually, it’s Jesus speaking in him, and He IS mentioning a woman in a leading position in the local church of her day in Thyatira (Revelation 2:18-20).

rev2-18-29poisoninthepulpit-761830

VERSE 20:  “But I have this against you:  that you tolerate the woman Jezebel, who calls herself a prophetess, and who is teaching and leading astray my servants…”

She is teaching, and obviously has quite a following.  She even calls herself a “prophetess”.  Yes, her name is JEZEBEL…the New Testament Jezebel.  And no, I’m not labeling ALL modern day female leaders “Jezebel.”  I refer that only a woman teacher of God’s people in all of Scripture is a “wicked” woman.

Here then is what I believe, the whole counsel on my thesis.  And, of course there will be many who disagree.  

WOMEN DO HAVE SPECIFIC TASKS TO PERFORM IN THE CHURCH!  AMEN!!

  • They are to stand behind their husbands, serving him as the Lord.
  • They are to pass the faith on to their daughters and grandchildren and other women who need teaching because of a lack of it at home.

But they must keep SILENT when the church assemblies gather for worship, prayer and the Word of God.

Is there a woman in this wicked age who can hear the VOICE of God and keep this hard word?

I truly believe that a special reward will be hers when the Lord, Who sees all, returns to claim His own!

bride4christ 

 


CREDITS & FOOTNOTES

The Interlinear Bible, Hebrew, Greek, English.

** For footnotes, photos, Bible translations used, see PART ONE.

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8 Replies to “Has Church Doctrine Become Culturally Conditioned? (PART TWO)”

  1. I love listening to women speak! Especially those who have a point, but not argumentive. You are certainly are gifted with knowledge from the Scripture, but that said…your godly wisdom seems to need developed and guided by the Spirit rather than man (Proverbs 1:2-5). I always appreciate other people’s take on my blogs, but at the same time, you don’t need a “point” to have a point!

    ________________________________

  2. I’ll only use the scriptures to prove my point. “Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience as also saith the law.

    35 And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church.

    36 What? came the word of God out from you? or came it unto you only?” 1 Cor. 14:34-36.

    “I commend to you our sister Phoebe, a deacon of the church in Cenchreae. Romans 16:1…Greet Priscilla and Aquila, my co-workers in Christ Jesus.” (Romans 16:3 NIV)

    “When King Josiah heard the book of the law, he rent his clothes and sent his priest to a mighty prophetess named Huldah. She was keeper of the wardrobe; now she dwelt in Jerusalem in the college; and they communed with her.” (2 Kings 22:11 NLT)
    “Now there was at Joppa a CERTAIN DISCIPLE named TABITHA, which by interpretation is called Dorcas: this woman was full of good works and almsdeeds which she did.” (Acts 9:36 KJV) “Greet Andronicus and Junia, my fellow Jews who have been in prison with me. They are outstanding among the apostles, and they were in Christ before I was.” (Romans 16:7 NIV)
    Acts 18:26 – And he began to speak boldly in the synagogue: whom when Aquila and Priscilla had heard, they took him unto [them], and expounded unto him the way of God more perfectly.

    Clothed with strength and dignity,
    she can laugh at the days to come.
    פ
    26
    When she opens her mouth, she speaks wisely;
    on her tongue is loving instruction.
    צ
    27
    She watches how things go in her house,
    not eating the bread of idleness.” Proverbs 31: 25-27.

    Her children arise; they make her happy;
    her husband too, as he praises her:
    ר
    29
    “Many women have done wonderful things,
    but you surpass them all!”

    What is it then, brothers and sisters? Whenever you come together, each one has a psalm, a teaching, a revelation, a tongue, an interpretation. Let all things be done for edification. (1 Cor. 14:26 TLV)

    Many blessings! If you get a chance study the site I sent you it has a lot of great teachings about women and men and their roles.

  3. One more thing you may not know: “She was to be his “helper”–at least that is how most of the translations have interpreted this word. A sample of the translations reads as follows:

    ‘I shall make a helper fit for him’ (RSV); ‘I will make a fitting helper for him’ (New Jewish Publication Society); ‘I will make an aid fit for him’ (AB); ‘I will make him a helpmate’ (JB); ‘I will make a suitable partner for him’ (NAB); ‘I will make him a helper comparable to him’ (NKJV).

    [Source: Hard Sayings of the Bible by Walter C. Kaiser, Peter H. Davids, F. F. Bruce, and Manfred Brauch]

    However, the customary translation of the two words `ezer kenegdo as “helper fit is almost certainly wrong. Recently R. David Freedman has pointed out that the Hebrew word ezer is a combination of two roots: `-z-r, meaning “to rescue, to save,” and g-z-r, meaning “to be strong.” The difference between the two is the first letter in Hebrew. Today that letter is silent in Hebrew; but in ancient times, it was a guttural sound formed in the back of the throat. The “g” was a ghayyin, and it came to use the same Hebrew symbol as the other sound, `ayin. But the fact that they were pronounced differently is clear from such place names which preserve the “g” sound, such as Gaza or Gomorrah. Some Semitic languages distinguished between these two signs and others did not. For example, Ugaritic did make a distinction between the `ayin and the ghayyin; Hebrew did not. (R. David Freedman, “Woman, a Power Equal to a Man,” Biblical Archaeology Review 9 [1983]: 56-58).

    For this reason a man shall leave his father and his mother, and be joined to his wife; and they shall become one flesh. (Gen 2:24)

    The clause “for this reason” refers us back to verse 23. BECAUSE woman was taken FROM man[1], it is necessary that he one day leave his father and mother and be joined with his wife or ezer kenegdo. Think about this for a moment. In our culture and most of the world, men have historically held a hierarchical position over women. So the obvious question is why does the man leave his father and mother to be joined to his wife? Would it not make more sense for the woman to leave the “covering” of her father and mother and then be joined to her husband? In actuality, both the man and the woman leave the covering of their parents to join together to create a new “house” or creation. The man covers the woman in one way and she covers him in another. We will build on this concept throughout the series.

    And then the serpent approaches Chavah (Eve). But WHY does he approach Chavah and not Adam? If Adam is Chavah’s protector, wouldn’t the serpent first approach Adam? That is IF Adam was indeed functioning in the role of “gatekeeper” in their relationship. Most commentators throughout the centuries assume that the serpent’s choice in approaching Chavah was due to her propensity toward deception. She was weak. But nowhere does the Genesis text imply such notions. We must adjust our preconceived ideas about Chavah and the garden. Remember Chavah was specifically designed by the Creator of the Universe to guard and protect Adam. Is it possible that the reason the serpent approached Chavah is precisely because she IS the “gatekeeper” and protector of the relationship? Adam was allowing Chavah to function in her God given role and the serpent knew if he could beguile Chavah (the guard), he also had Adam.

    I realize this rubs against the grain of many theological boxes and makes some people very uncomfortable. Therefore, before I continue, I must state right here that what I’m submitting is NOT a feminine hierarchy. Chavah’s role was not a higher status than Adam’s. As a matter of fact, as we will see, neither my musings in this article nor Dr. Moen’s book support hierarchy roles for either gender. Instead, they bring balance and equality back into relationships and fellowships, IF the parties involved seek out biblical restoration.

    The Boundary Setter

    The woman said to the serpent, “From the fruit of the trees of the garden we may eat; but from the fruit of the tree which is in the middle of the garden, God has said, ‘You shall not eat from it or touch it, or you will die.’” (Gen. 3:2-3 NASB)

    Chavah is the first person to initiate a “fence-law” around God’s Word. A fence law is a manmade law designed to guard or protect someone from even coming close to breaking one of God’s commandments. ” Grace in Torah. K Gallagher

    1. Just a note in the second to last paragraph: God never said “touch”. Your research is entirely dependant on commentators, where the Spirit is totally absent. The Holy Spirit is our guide…not some teacher in seminary whose own ideas have supplanted God’s Word.

  4. I did not mean to be biased or rude. This is a topic very dear to my heart not because I long to be in a spotlight or usurp my husband. Any time we ever have spoken in an assembly he speaks first, I speak and he closes.
    Yes, most believe a woman very close to Paul wrote Hebrews. Do the research.
    I guess it’s okay for women to write blogs because you tend to like mine?

    1. Writing and teaching are two different terms. I find it amazing that when Scripture doesn’t fit with their own understanding, they will find another opinion that fits theirs, then call it gospel. Paul says, in 2 Timothy 3, in the Amplified Bible, “they are forever inquiring and getting information, but are never able to arrive at a recognition and knowledge of the Truth’ (verses 7). “Tend to like” is erroneous. ‘Like some.’ is more accurate.

  5. A woman wrote the book of Hebrews. A woman named Tabitha was a disciple. She was no less a disciple than Jesus 12.
    These passages by Paul that you have written about are very much misconstrued. If you read the whole book and the previous book you find out much more information about the goddess worship in that area and the thinking that women were created first. These women in that area were trying to teach about Diana and goddess type pagan worship. They even dressed like their idols– the ones the blacksmith was making. Deeper study of the Hebrew will show you the woman was and is the one who was guarding the tree and battling with the serpent while her husband remained silent.
    First Corinthians 14:34-36. Read verse 36 and notice the sarcasm of Paul. He says afterwards ” was it from you the Word of God came first? Or was it from you only?”
    Also many women had house churches. They led the meetings and Paul acknowledged them. Lydia is a woman you might want to study deeper. The Father does not pour out His spirit on women and handmaidens to keep it bottled and silent.

    Women have always prophesied as did Anna in the temple over the baby Messiah, as did the woman at the well who was the first evangelist… many in her town believed because of her words. That’s what the Word of Yah says.
    The Father has used too many women to count. Jezebel was not the only type of poison in the church that Jesus hated– spirit of Balaam and the nicolatians who love to control their platforms and stage area for their shows.
    I think you need to do some more research.
    Blessings

    1. A WOMAN WROTE THE BOOK OF HEBREW? Really? As I said in my biblical study, some will not grab hold of the word. And as far as studying Lydia…interesting you should mention her. Your comments are obviously gender biased and not God biased! Sorry!! I never said, nor intended readers to think that “women and handmaidens” were to keep God’s Spirit “bottled and silent” as you said. Read the study more carefully before you jump because of prideful bias. And your misunderstanding is perhaps the reason for Paul’s teaching that women shouldn’t teach men…nor women either in your case.(that’s my opinion)

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